Re: [ga] let's try to see this constructively... and not over rea ct ...

[Jeff Williams <jwkckid1@ix.netcom.com>]

Marilyn and all assembly members,

  Good point Merilyn, and I amongst some of our members did just
as you suggest.  However Jonathan's comments are still strong points
none the less.

Cade,Marilyn S - LGA wrote:

> Jonathan, and Michael and others...
>
> Why not use the narrative questions to include other perspectives that you
> think aren't included, as informational points?
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jonathan Weinberg [mailto:weinberg@mail.msen.com]
> Sent: Thursday, June 14, 2001 9:44 PM
> To: Cade,Marilyn S - LGA; 'Michael Froomkin'; 'Danny Younger'
> Cc: 'ga@dnso.org'
> Subject: Re: [ga] let's try to see this constructively... and not over
> react ...
>
>          I think you miss Michael's point, Marilyn.  He's not saying that
> the study is statistically invalid because it allows for narrative
> responses.  He's saying that it's invalid because it's systematically
> biased in favor of one set of results.  Thus, for example, he mentions
> Question 9, which asks whether each whois data element is "essential,"
> "desirable" or "valueless."  Problem is, almost any information has
> value.  Nobody would say that a registrant's postal address, say, is
> "valueless" -- but the survey gives no opportunity to say that it is
> nonetheless unnecessary, or that the privacy costs associated with
> including it outweigh that value.  Rather, the respondent's only other
> choices are that the information is either "essential" or
> "desirable."  That's a slanted question.
>
>          I think that everyone should fill out the survey, notwithstanding
> its bias, because -- like it or not -- the responses this survey generates
> will help shape ICANN action.  But that doesn't mean that one shouldn't
> point out the survey's rather unfortunate flaws.
>
> Jon
>
> At 09:12 PM 6/14/2001 -0400, Cade,Marilyn S - LGA wrote:
>
> >I agree with Danny's response. In my view, always easy to be critical;
> >better to be constructive.
> >
> >I regret that Michael has expressed only concerns. Isn't the survey  not to
> >determine an outcome in itself, but to try to gather information?
> >Obviously, using narrative responses is not going to result in a
> >statistically valid study; and given the method of distribution, it isn't a
> >"sample", but that wasn't and isn't the point, I would say.
> >
> >I still encourage everyone who uses WHOIS to respond and to be
> constructive.
> >
> >I believe that even sociologists sometimes do non-statistical "field
> >research"....
> >
> >
> >
> >Marilyn
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: Michael Froomkin [mailto:froomkin@law.miami.edu]
> >Sent: Thursday, June 14, 2001 7:48 PM
> >To: Danny Younger
> >Cc: ga@dnso.org
> >Subject: Re: [ga] Re: "They're Coming To Take Me Away. Ha Ha."
> >
> >
> >I meant a professional with experience in survey design, not someone paid
> by
> >ICANN to do whatever it is ICANN pays them to do.  It goes without saying
> >that
> >no one at ICANN, or the NC, has this somewhat specialist skill (although I
> >would
> >not be surprised to find it in the GA somewhere).  No blame attaches for
> >this,
> >as there is no reason we should expect them to--it's a technical body
> >(right?),
> >not a social science research unit.  But nor should we place much credence
> >in
> >the results, whoever designed it.
> >
> >I don't see the value of a lot of energy being used to produce something
> >that
> >cannot be relied on.   The lesson is: if you are going to do a survey, run
> >it by
> >someone who designs them for a living.   Someone in a sociology department
> >or a
> >psychology department of a university who does empirical work if you can't
> >get a
> >professional pollster.
> >
> >In fact, given the bias of the design, the greater the 'outreach' for this
> >survey, the greater the damage.
> >
> >[I'll almost certainly be offline from now until Tuesday due to travel.]
> >
> >Danny Younger wrote:
> >
> > > With regard to the WHOIS survey, Michael Froomkin writes:  "I wish
> whoever
> > > wrote this had consulted a professional."
> > >
> > > Actually, we are probably quite lucky that the Names Council's WHOIS
> > > committee (of which I am also a member) wrestled this project away from
> >the
> > > ICANN staff which some time ago had formed its own WHOIS Committee
> > > http://www.icann.org/committees/whois/.  Yes, it might have been more
> > > professional had the ICANN staff devoted their full-time professional
> >skills
> > > to it, but I for one am quite happy to see the uncompensated volunteer
> > > members of the Names Council showing some real initiative and a desire
> to
> > > address the problems that lay ahead.
> > >
> > > Whatever this survey may lack in "design", one has to admit there has
> been
> >a
> > > major effort made at outreach, along with a significant effort to
> >translate
> > > this survey into multiple languages (more soon to be forthcoming).
> Please
> > > bear in mind that this is only step one in a much longer process that
> will
> > > fully involve the General Assembly.    Let's not go overboard with the
> > > criticism when it is clear that we are making forward progress.
> > >
> > > --
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Regards,

--
Jeffrey A. Williams
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