RE: [ga] NC members, censorship and other absurd things

[<idno@tallship.net>]

On Wed, 10 Nov 1999 R.Gaetano@iaea.org wrote:

> Javier,
> 
> You wrote:
> > 
> > Dear NC members,
> > Dear ICANN Board members
> > Dear NEW elected Icann Board members
> > 
> > Maybe your silence is building an atmosphere of Censorship.
> > 
> > Please, we need YOU spend some time to establish
> > a politic about the management of the list related to the ICANN
> > process.
> > 
> > This kind of "nobodie's land" is not helpfull to the ICANN
> > process.
> > 
> > Please, put some rules to avoid this air of censorship that
> > I understand that comes from your silence.  I understand
> > that there is a TON of things to do, but to preserve the
> > integrity of the open mailing lists would be one of the first
> > tasks that we must took in our hands.
> > 
> 
> I have found myself several times in the position of defending the right of
> my opponents to express the reasons for their disagreement, but I will not
> stretch it to the point of endorsing the right of insulting other human
> beings under the excuse of free speech.

But you have, your support for the activities of censorship in the form of
an endorsement letter is the type of thing that has caused this to occur.
> 
> No to censorship of ideas, but yes to civil discourse rules (something like
> http://www.open-rsc.org/lists/rules/ as a basis for discussion).

You are so correct here, and as I just stated in my post a few moments
ago, this is what is needed - not arbitrary censoreship. Your endorsement
of the censor in her blacklisting activities only serves to embolden that
strategy that she has engaged in - censoreship.

> A warning: already other DN-related lists have been abandoned by people who
> wanted to get some work done and not to read insults, with the effect of
> practically prevent any results to be achieved.

Then they were cowards who could only work in a vacuum. This is the real
world and sometimes it gets hot here.
> 
> > When I say "establish a politic" I mean set rules to avoid
> > censorship.  We, all, are grown people that know very well
> > how to use filters and to read what we want to read... we dont
> > need a BIG FATHER that can tell us what we can and what
> > we cannot read... 


> 
> Right, but when you start receiving messages faking up the identity of the
> sender, the average filtering process fails to function properly.

The process was failing to function properly and this was what caused it.
Please do not put the cart before the horse.
> 
> > 
> > I hope a public statement about the open, no censorship,
> > nature of this and all list related to the ICANN process.
> > 
> 
> .... plus a decision on civil discourse rules.

I could not agree with you more on this point.


> I think that the reason for having a mailing list is to discuss about a
> subject.
> To have a policy that does not allow to post subjects that have nothing to
> do with the scope of the list, just to make an example, has nothing to do
> with censorship, but only to preserve the reason for the mailing list to
> exist.
> The same holds for insulting people.

You are correct here too, but neither you nor I can control the behavior
of people inclined to resort to such antics.

> You say that we are all adults. Well, in this case we should be able to make
> a point without being abusive in the language we use.
> Again, don't forget that other mailing list have being disrupted because
> they failed to decide (and/or enforce) civil discourse rules.

The IDNO actaully did adopt the ORSC Rules of Civil Discourse, but was
prohibited from enacting them by it's dictator, Joop teernstra. That was
the last straw for most of the members of the IDNO's Steering Committee,
who resigned en masse over a one and a half day period as a result of Mr.
Teernstras behavior - either directly or indirectly.
>