Re: [wg-review] RE: Domains and other matters

["Miles B. Whitener" <mbw@i-theta.com>]

> 1/15/01 11:04:15 AM, "Miles B. Whitener" <mbw@i-theta.com>
wrote:
>
> >Think twice before you reject this answer as simplistic and
> >obvious, and I know it's been said many time, but that does
not
> >make it untrue:
> >
> >A domain name is just an entry in somebody's nameserver
> >configuration (and even at that, it's only an entry in a
server
> >abiding by the current, port-53 oriented, Domain Name system,
> >which can be replaced or paralleled!).
>
> Good, then we agree it's not, nor should it be considered a
trademark, nor should it be conflated with trademarks...?

Right.  Not commingled, conflated, mixed ... trademark litigation
stands alone.  It could be that use of a domain name would fall
under a trademark case, but it would be driven from the trademark
law side, not the domain side.  It would be only incidental to
the domain system, and none of the registrar's business, unless
and until ordered by a court to transfer a domain.  You cannot
isolate the domain system from this, but you can keep trademark
concepts _per_ _se_ out of the domain management system.  Is that
clear?

>
> >If you convince somebody
> >to make an entry for you, you have at least in some sense
> >established an agreement for service between you and the
entity
> >providing your subdomain name.
>
> What if you "pay" them to do this instead of "convince"?

You can (and often do) convince by way of paying.   There's no
contradiction.  The important concept is free exchange.

>
> >This could happen at the root
> >level ( Sotiris. ), second level (Sotiris-Sotiropoulos.org),
or
> >any other level (The-other.Sotiris-Sotiropoulos.org,
> >A-previously-undiscovered.other.Sotiris-Sotiropoulos.org,
> >Junior.Sotiris-Sotiropoulos.org).  The holder / manager /
owner
> >at each level can establish an agreement with users at the
next
> >lower level.  You can register under COM, then make a deal
with,
> >say, your son, to "register" his name under your domain.
>
> Just a second... now it's a "name"? not simply an entry in
somebody's nameserver configuration?  hmm..  and what is your
opinion on the USOC claim to
> "ownership" of the OLYMPIC word domains in cyberspace?

It's a name if you use it as one.  I don't know anything about
the Olympic issue, but I will say this: the Registrar has no
place in the debate, unless and until ordered by a court to
transfer a domain.  And the registrar should legally insulate
itself by requiring conflicting parties to keep registrar out of
the picture, like the old RFC based domain dispute policy.  The
newer NSI policy is insane.


>
> >The huge, and I think really the only question, is "who owns
the
> >root domain?"  (And the answer is "It's owned aggregately, and
in
> >individual proportions, by actual individual human beings.")
If
> >that can be dealt with, top level registrations should be
> >completely open, in my opinion.  Then, you can register simply
> >Sotiropoulos. ,  and IBM can register IBM.
>
> Ah yes... but if someone else had registered
Sotiropoulos.whatever, would my birth certificate, or passport,
or driver's licencse, or sole proprietorship
> business registration under my own name, give me any "rights"
to title for any Sotiropoulos.dot?  Or, would I have to simply
tuck tail and choose another
> name?  Again, you're trying to avoid the issue by sidestepping.
Please address the real question, not what you'd like it to be.

You negotiate with the owners of "the" (and I think that's the
fallacy) root domain in order to create, modify or delete a TLD.
They might agree to a one time purchase, or they might want an
annual fee.  They might raise the fee every year.  You might have
to use an alternate Name Service or even an alternate Internet if
you don't like any of that.

I don't think I am sidestepping by saying:  whoever registers it
first gets it, unless a challenger can convince (NOT PAY :-) a
court to force it out of the first party's hands.  I think I will
go register sotiropoulus.org right now .... ;--)  ooops,
somebody's got it ... but good news, Sotiris-Sotiropoulos.org is
still available.  If I grab it, you should have no recourse but
to ask me for it, or try to get some court to yank it.  NOT THE
REGISTRY.  What registry in its right mind would WANT to be in
the middle of such issues?   Insane.

Have I sidestepped?

>
> >Managing the root
> >domain (referred to as dot by some) is the only tricky issue.
It
> >would seem that this can be done outside of governments or
under
> >them.  Many would prefer this to be a collegial process not
> >requiring governmental power nor involvement, but I think the
> >outcome of such a process would be just a temporary illusion.
>
> Why am I not surprised?  You attack an entire nation and call
it a tyrrany... what's to stop you from claiming the only solid
purchase on reality in this WG?
> I suggest you rethink your position, as it doesn't appear to
have been thought at all.


Governments are going to get into the picture.  You can't just
sidestep them.  My comment about Germany should have had a
smiley.  My family heritage is partly germanic.  I strongly
defend them in many ways.



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